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tv   Larry King Live  CNN  July 10, 2009 9:00pm-10:00pm EDT

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tonight, michael jackson's shocking pill habit and what he allegedly did to feed it. confidential documents reveal that he popped dozens a night just so he could sleep. plus, joe jackson, the singer's dad speaks out and blames foul play for his son's passing. then the investigation into michael's mysterious death. where does it stand right now? and live to the memorial service in jackson's hometown. fans in gary, indiana, say good-bye to a favorite son next on "larry king live."
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>> larry: good evening. you're now looking live at a memorial service for michael jackson taking place at a baseball field in gary, indiana. the singer's father, joe jackson, is there and we'll be bringing it to you throughout the hour. first, let's talk about developments in the investigation today. cnn's ted rowlands is with us. attorney mark geragos is in new york. he's here as well. he was michael jackson's lawyer, by the way, at one time. and robin saks, deputy district attorney for los angeles county joins us too. all right, ted, what is this about -- we know more about pill use. what do we know? >> well, in terms of the pill use, we're getting in every day, there's more people coming out of the woodwork, obviously, larry, saying that michael jackson was addicted to x, y, and z. what's now come out is some circumstantial evidence that he may have had a severe addiction problem back when mark was actually representing him, during that child molestation trial. a security guard told santa barbara county investigators that he was taking ten, in
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excess of ten xanax pills a night to sleep. but this is just the latest, obviously, in a long series of people coming forward. >> mark, what does all that mean? >> i don't know what it means. a lot of the stuff that's come out today are documents that were filed in connection with the search warrants years ago and they basically were affidavits of cops who said they interviewed somebody and somebody told them something. so they were double hearsay and i never put much stock in any of that, other than somebody who's got an ax to grind. and i don't know what something five years ago informs what happened now, and like i say, all it was was allegations at the time and it's just rehashed allegations now. >> seems peculiar to me. robin, last night ted interviewed police chief bratton who said this could become a homicide investigation. how does this figure as homicide? >> reporter: well, the way that the law works here in california is there is different types of homicide law and you can have murder, first-degree murder,
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which is what we normally hear about, specific intent to kill. in this case, which would be an involuntary manslaughter type of case and that's what bratton would be looking at. >> larry: the doctor would be charged? >> that's correct. whether or not someone gave mr. jackson, medication, pills, whatever, that they knew that could likely cause him to kill himself. >> larry: of course, a doctor getting paid by mr. jackson would be unlikely want to kill him. >> that's correct. you would hope not. but what would happen is that mr. jackson having a drug problem could seek seeing a doctor, trying to get a prescription for whatever drugs and the drugs that we've seen in this case, so far, come forward are only drugs a doctor could prescribe. >> larry: ted, logically, all of this is conjecture until you get an autopsy? >> absolutely. that's what chief bratton said yesterday, that they're moving forward to cover themselves if it becomes a homicide investigation. but clearly they said the coroner's got the next move in this. wait for the toxicology to come back and then you can move forward. >> larry: mark, sit logical to
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move forward here if a doctor overprescribed? >> there is some precedent for it recently when the attorney general charged various people in connection with anna nicole smith. and as robin said, they can do it as a manslaughter. they also -- there's a recent california supreme court which would give them some impetus if they wanted to charge it as what's called an implied malice, second-degree murder. what they're saying is, in line with your comment, nobody -- you don't have to have that intent to kill, but if there is just such reckless disregard or gross negligence rising to the level where somebody knew or should have known, that could imply the malice. and somebody could arguably, some ambitious or aggressive prosecutor could file charges up into and including second-degree murder? >> larry: robin, is that tough to prove? >> first of all, there are so many doctors in michael jackson's life. so many different people. >> larry: who do you blame?
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>> who do you blame? which doctor, which prescription, which drug do you blame? was it the drug, the combination of drugs? so you still have a causation of being able to point the finger at someone, and who is that? >> larry: what's the latest on the body, ted. >> that's a still big mystery, where the body is. there are reports that the lapd helped facilitate the removal of it from staples center. the family is saying, we don't want to talk about it, because clearly they haven't made a decision for what they want for jackson's final resting spot. it's a mystery, but the family wants it that way, cholesterlea. if we knew where the body was, the press would be camped outside thatmo at neverland? >> he could. the family would have to get permission from the state and the county authorities. i manual he's a beloved figure in that county, especially in the northern end of that county.
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i imagine they probably would grant permission, and if they did, then they could bury him there. it's up to the family to decide where they want to bury him and whether or not the county is going to allow them to do it, i think, is secondary. >> larry: robin, if the autopsy says accidental death, not conclusive, does that end all of this homicide business? >> well, it depends how much pressure the family brings forward in terms of -- i don't think it's going to completely end the investigation. i think that's -- i think it should, but i think that given the fact that michael jackson is a celebrity and now adorned the way that he has been adorned, i think there's going to be a feeling that there needs to be some due diligence in making sure that every "t" is crossed and every "i" is dotted. >> larry: there's a famous story, john garfield, terrific actor, died in unusual circumstances. he was found in bed with another woman, he was married. so there were stories like this every day in the press. until one day someone came up with a story that the next story will be garfield's still dead.
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are we coming to that? is jackson still dead -- i mean, how long does this go? >> well, that's a good question. initially, i think it's going to go pretty heavy until the toxicology results come back. and then if there is homicide is cause of death, you'll have a whole another, whoever the doctor is that gets charged, that will have a life of its own. it could go a long way. but it's a good question. >> larry: do you know when we get the toxicology report? >> according to the coroner, they're still looking at two weeks for the final report. >> and is that definitive. >> it may not be definitive, especially when you're talking about diprivan, a drug that leaves the system very quickly. >> larry: you're looking right now at jesse jackson. he's at michael's memorial in gary, indiana. the reverend will join us later. more on the medical angle. why would michael jackson be taking so many pills? we're going to be joined by an addiction expert, next. stay with us. if you're taking 8 extra-strength tylenol...
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♪ >> that was moments ago at the
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jackson memorial in gary, indiana. dancers performing a routine to "thriller." a tribute to the hometown hero, michael jackson. we're joined now by dr. wreath creme, psychologist who specializes in addiction. he's medical director of the control center in beverly hills. what do you make of these reports that michael was taking ten xanax pills a night? again, that's not a fact. >> ten xanax pills, it depends on what dose it is. there's two milligram pills, one milligram, 0.25. if it's two milligrams, it's a lot. >> larry: there are reports he had employees getting them for h him. what kind of signal does that send? >> a big red warning flag, danger, danger. at the point when you're undergoing deception to design a drug use program where you can get these drugs from other
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people, it's a big-time red flag that you need help. >> larry: have you ever heard of anyone taking diprivan at home? >> never. >> larry: it's anesthesia? >> it's an anesthesia drug you use in an o.r. just the fact that you would have it at home is red flag number two. it's all adding up as a definitive problem. >> larry: does it look like people were involved that shouldn't have been involved in getting him drugs? >> yes. you can't get those drugs on your home. if you're surrounded by a lot of people who are yes people, whose jobs, whose income, whose identity is based on you, what are you going to do? >> larry: a lot of people could get xanax? >> yeah. >> larry: joe jackson told abc news he believes michael's death was due to foul play. watch. >> i couldn't believe what was happening to michael. i just couldn't believe it. and i do believe it was foul play. i do believe that. yes. >> reporter: robin, what do you make of that? >> well, i think that there does
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have an our roadway aura of fou you're talking about drugs that most of us have never heard about until this case came about. we've heard about xanax, about painkillers, but hearing about anesthetics that are only used in an o.r., take it to a whole new level. >> larry: mark, does that fit foul play? >> i think there's that connotation that if it's foul play, that somebody did something nefarious and i think prosecutors or police would say, if they're building a case that the nefarious act or the foul play is by giving drugs or prescribing drugs that ended up doing something that ended up in his death. whether that was an overdose or whether it was suppressing his system, such that he couldn't breathe anymore and went into cardiac arrest, i don't know. all of it, as you say, though, is speculation until you get a toxicology report. and until the coroner finally rules as to what happened. >> larry: doctor, people keep saying these drugs, viocdin,
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xanax and all this, now somebody's got to benefit from these. i would assume, or why are they on the market? >> these are very good drugs. >> larry: are they good drugs? >> they're very good drugs, taken as prescribed. there are so many dr. feelgoods out there and they're making my life miserable. i'm sitting here trying to get people off of these medications. that's my job, as an addiction doc, i'm trying to get them off. i've got somebody, they're finally sober, everything is good, take a trip over to dr. feelgood in the valley and all of a sudden they're getting 30, 60, 90 pills. >> larry: father joe jackson is now entering the memorial at the baseball park in gary, indiana, where all the jacksons were born. a city not many miles from chicago. robin, does this -- as a prosecutor, would you be looking around here? would you be -- would you be inserting yourself? >> as a prosecutor, i would want to keep my eyes wide open right
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now to look at all of the people that are coming forward now, look for what everyone has to say. i'm very curious as to joe jackson's position now, all of a sudden he's calling foul play, he's had some other interesting colorful pasts that made me question his integrity. >> how would he know if there was foul play? >> especially if he didn't have a relationship with him for a number of years. >> when we come back, we'll meet two top medical examiners. our panel will hold because we'll be coming back to them. i would say convenience is something that the bank of america really has the market cornered on. let me make it easier for you. let me show you how i can make it easier for you. online banking is going to be your best friend; it's going to help you manage your money. it has an alert system that can text message you.
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we have great new image atms. it will give you a receipt which has a copy of the check you deposited. you're in control of your finances. now when you talk about convenience, you measure us up to everyone else. well, you'll see we stand ahead of the curve. >> larry: father joe jackson has
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been introduced at the memorial in gary, indiana. let's listen. >> you know, it's always good to come back home, you know that. but i've been around the world so many times so it does feel good to be back home. yes, okay? jesse, how you doing? >> let's hear it for joe jackson! he'll be back just a little bit later in the program. just a little bit later in the program. all right, the mayor's going to do the presentation. all right. >> so joe says he'll be right back up later on, okay? we're going to let him enjoy the show.
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>> larry: we'll be back in a moment. ♪ (announcer) introducing new tums dual action. this tums goes to work in seconds and lasts for hours. all day or night. new tums dual action. bring it on.
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>> larry: joining us now in pittsburgh, dr. cyril wecht, the former coronerlegheny county, pennsylvania. and dr. stanford lee, forensic scientist at the university of new haven and author of "blood crimes." dr. wecht, what about this from a toxicology report would tell you there was a homicide? >> well, homicide determination
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is a legal one as miss sax and mark have already portrayed. it will be the determination of the prosecutor's office. i've been involved in a few cases, at a federal level, in which charges of homicide have been brought. there's a specific federal statute if somebody supplies drugs, sells, or just gives drugs resulting in someone's death -- >> larry: all right. will the report, in your opinion, will definitive? >> it will be definitive in the report of the drugs that led to his death. it will not necessarily be definitive in all of the drugs that have been prescribed improperly for him over the years. there's no way to determine that. he doesn't have lengthy hair which can be studied. you can only go back a few days. >> larry: i got you. dr. lee, how many days did drugs stay in the body for determination of autopsy? >> it depends on the type of the drug.
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the investigation involves toxicologist report of medical examiner, of course, scientists. and homicide investigator, if it's a homicide, we have to look and use two different approaches, one called data mining, the second one is a record cross checking. the data mining, you have to see all the records from the physician's office, including the computer. then we look at all the drugs seized in any aisles from his home, tried to cross-check him, look at the names, the date, the pharmacy, were they prescribed to jackson himself, friends or an employee, tried toot a data mining and determine that's a homicide. >> larry: dr. wecht, if diprivan is found, which is an anesthesia, performed in a hospital, would that automatically indicate to you foul play? >> well, i would not call it foul play, as we use it as
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forensic pathologists and coroners and medical examiner offices, that is used to indicate that someone did something of a deliberate nature. how, if diprivan was given to michael jackson, prescribed by some physician and it was administered by him or anybody else at his home, then as far as i'm concerned, it goes beyond negligence, goes beyond simple malpractice. it rises to the level of gross wanton negligence, which as i understand it, is manslaughter. diprivan is a hypnotic anesthetic. it is to be used only in a hospital by a trained anesthetist. you have to watch the pulse and blood pressure, because that drug can lead to a marked drop in blood pressure and lead to respiratory respiration. you don't have that at somebody's home. that goes beyond simple negligence. >> larry: doctor lee, i had diprivan recently in a hospital
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for a cataract surgery. it was very simple and very effective and i woke up and in a minute, it was like, gone. how long does it stay in the system? >> supposedly, only a few hours after you wake up, but some it depends on what the dose is and how long you being used that quite a bit with other drug and maybe stay in your system longer. >> larry: would an autopsy show it, dr. wecht, always, would it show diprivan if that was in the body? >> well, as henry has pointed out, it does lead to a metabolism very quickly, but it will be present for a few hours. and they will be looking for it not only in the blood, but in the tissues. and that kind of analysis will take a while. and by the way, larry, i think they would be very wise if they also sent specimens to a separate independent forensic toxicology lab for corroboration for backup in a case of this nature. and i would be willing to bet that they may well have done that. so they'll look for me tab li
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lithes of all the drugs mentioned on your program to see if there was any evidence of those drugs in his system? >> larry: dr. lee, if you're going to send it to other labs, it's not an exact science? >> it's an exact science. any leading toxicologist can do an analysis to confer. and to date instrumentation is so good, i don't think any problem. just confirmation, basically, to back up the study. >> larry: i got you. thank you. thanks dr. cyril wecht and dr. henry lee, two of the top pathologists in the country. we'll be back with dr. reef kairm, mark geragos, and dr. sax. (man) i'm rethinking everything... including who i trust to look after my money. ♪
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we're back with dr. reef creme, psychiatrist, mark geragos, and robin sax, author of "predators and child molesters." any of you see a similarity with anna nicole smith, robin? >> i think the similarity is clearly in the drug use and the sad, awful story and the tragedy of loss with young kids. i see that as being similar, but i also see a lot of differences in terms of the caretaking, i think anna nicole smith's caretaking was much more limited to one or two people as opposed to the plethora of people michael jackson had around. >> larry: chief bratton spoke about this last night with
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doctors. watch. >> in looking at his prescription drug history, the doctors that he's dealt with over the years, we have the cooperation of the dea and the state attorney general's office, who keep those records, so those are being looked at by our personnel. >> larry: mark, you're a defense attorney. are they going about this the right way? >> there's only basically one way that they can go about it, at this point. until they get records back and that they can determine what the cause of death was and whether or not there's a toxicology report that shows levels. there's only so much they can do. and what henry was describing in terms of looking at whatever pill bottles were found and going back and looking at whoever prescribed it and or not a certain doctor knew that other doctors were also prescribing, that's generally kind of the investigation 101. >> larry: all right. so they're staying right the core, in your -- >> yeah, this is standard
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operating procedure and the ag's office being involved and the dea being involved is appropriate, especially in a case that's this high profile. there's always going to be every alphabet agency is going to be involved in order to determine whether or not there's been any kind of misconduct. >> larry: dr. karim, you deal with people addicted, right? explain something baffling to me. if i explain, you see these drugs, they kill people, you take these, you're going to die. you're going to overdose, you're going to get addicted. why would anybody start? >> if it's an illegal drug, heroin, cocaine, i get what you're saying. but some people are really unhappy, some people are really anxious. it's not like we all walk around and the addicts in society have a big "a" on their foreheads to
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show they're addicts. >> larry: somebody should not be prescribes viocdin qup. >> somebody with a genetic history, a family condition, someone with a mental health disorder, they could be more vulnerable than anybody else. and in the future, we'll do chromosomal typing and we'll know what people based on their genetic history are more susceptible to addiction. >> larry: if there is a prosecution, suppose a doctor is arrested and charged, would you prosecute that vigorously? >> i absolutely would prosecute it vigorously. i think that there is not enough coordination that's done, actually, between the agencies, between the state in terms of holding doctors accountable and i think there needs to be a precedent set and be able to help people get out of their own way. >> larry: if there's an assumption that michael was a predator, since he was found not guilty, would be an assumption, wouldn't that benefit the
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defendant? >> would that benefit the -- >> larry: because the jury would say, michael jackson brought it on himself. he was a bad guy. >> well, i don't think -- i think you kind of have to equate it like to gang crime. when you deal with gang crime, you have on behalf of the murdered, the victim is a murderer itself, but you have to look at it as the crime itself. here i look at the doctor completely separate from the personality of michael jackson and i imagine that all that evidence about his past and sexual past would be secluded. >> larry: mike, why are doctors susceptible to celebrities and giving of drugs? >> because they're human like everybody else. i think the problem with prosecuting cases like this is this the obvious argument is, if is this doctor wasn't doing it, some other doctor was. when chief bratton talks about the numbers of doctors they're investigating, that would be
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from a defense standpoint that's where you would start with. how do i know if i'm a doctor that all the doctors were also prescribing. if he wasn't telling me, go to somebody else. it's an entirely very difficult kind of thing, i think, to prosecute. although at a certain point, if it's over a period of time, then you have to show that there's a problem. i think cyril's point earlier, though, is probably one of the most telling. if there is something like diprivan there, if you can show that somebody prescribed it or that they gave it to him and he was in home use, and all of this is speculation, obviously, then that's a real problem. that in and of itself, if you parade in as a prosecutor the number of witnesses who say, no, this should never be in the home, it should only be in a hospital, that's something that is going to resonate with jurors. >> larry: yeah. mark and robin will be back with us. dr. karim will be with us on another night, i'm sure, because this is never-ending. jesse jackson is next. don't go away. ♪
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♪ i'll be there >> larry: all right, we go now to gary, indiana, where reverend jesse jackson is standing by. what's that scene been like, jesse? >> this is phenomenal, you know. in hollywood, we saw the
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jennifer hudsons, the stevie wonders, here is the raw brothers. here are the abcs, here's where it all began. 11 people, nine of them living in a four-room house on jackson street. and that was his first platform to learn the dance, to sing, a father, two jobs, a disciplinarian, a mama who was a seamstress. this is the origin of this great family. >> larry: what's the reaction of the people of gary toward him? >> they feel so proud of the fact that he came from here. but they also talk so much about the jackson family and its values. you know, when you think about 11 people living in four rooms, six boys in bunk beds in one room with their parents and three girls in the front and then there was structure, a sense of responsibility, a sense
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of mutual obligation, michael comes from these origins. so that's just the family comes. and of course when you have a two-parent household, religious values and strong discipline, it creates great by-products. >> larry: jesse, isn't middle america kind of bothered by all they hear about michael? >> yeah, they hear a lot, but what they know is that he was to them the most phenomenal recording artist in the history of the world. for him, they were proud of him. a hometown boy who made good. and that's the balance of what they hear and what they know. i think in the end, he'll be known by his musical genius, by his dance, and by his innovation. they do not know quite what all of the innuendos and rumors mean, so they're more patient than people who have to put up with 24-hours news cycles. >> larry: as a man of the cloth, are you concerned if there was drug use and improperly given by doctors. does it bother you? >> it bothers me very much that
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we know that the doctor did not talk with the parents, did not talk sign the gift certificates, showed up later with a lawyer. it raises very suspicious questions, of course, and it does concern me. and that michael was involved in self-prescribed drug rehearsal to him and had the doctor do his hypocritical -- his hippocratic oath and do his duty. we don't know the answers to these questions, but we're willing to wait and find out. >> larry: agreed. how's the family doing? >> well, it seems to me that you have a big family, number one, and one that has now, they've lost a lot, they have a lot left. and the family has very strong religious values. mrs. jackson is a very strong, devout, practicing e ining jeho
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witness and so is rebbie. i watched them over these past few days and watched that family come together to build the great momentum we saw in the event on this past tuesday. to watch his children interact with his grandparents in that compound. so i think even though there are unanswered questions that they have and there is still some angst, there is great strength in this family. >> larry: do you agree with reverend sharpton that michael's importance was bigger than music? that he broke down more racial barriers than we give him credit for? >> well, he was a product of an era of when they were coming down. how can i put this? the richard hatcher inauguration of 1967. then a summit at expo. so as those walls are coming down, more blacks and whites go to school together, lived
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together, play ball together, sing and dance together. he was, in some ways, a product of that age and helped create it. before there was a michael reaching across, there was nat cole doing christmas songs, but couldn't quite get across, a 15-minute tv show without sponsors and sinatra. so we reached out for a long time, but michael came at a time that as walls were coming down, he was building bridges. a perfect mix for the man in this time. >> thank you as always, reverend jesse jackson on the scene in gary, indiana, at this memorial service tonight. we'll be back in 60 seconds with more.
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>> larry: here's a look, by the way, at the best of, highlights from the michael jackson memorial under way in gary, indiana, tonight. watch. ♪ ♪ because i'm bad, i'm bad come on ♪ ♪ you know i'm bad, i'm bad
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you know it ♪ ♪ you know i'm bad, i'm bad come on, you know ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ i'm starting with the man in the mirror ♪ ♪ i'm asking him to change his ways ♪ ♪ and no message could have been any clearer ♪ ♪ if you wanna make the world a better place ♪ ♪ take a look at yourself, and then make a change ♪ >> larry: an anesthesiologist who's also a pain management expert will join our panel next. what does he have to say about michael's alleged drug use? we'll find out together.
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>> larry: we're back. mark geragos, robin sax and ted rowlands remain. we're joined now by dr. victim lalala, anesthesiologist, also specialist in pain management and treatment of addiction. ever heard of diprivan in a home? >> never. there's no medical indication to use diprivan outside of a hospital setting or an ambulatory surgery center. >> larry: must be given inintravenously? >> must. >> larry: therefore you couldn't do it yourself. there's no pill is there? >> there's no diprivan pill, however, someone who inject themselves with certain medications can certainly inject themselves with diprivan. >> larry: how could you possibly obtain it? >> very difficult. even in the medical world, only people that can really obtain it
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are anesthesiologists. or directors of a surgery center or a hospital. sfwll now, this is still speculation. we don't know if it was isn't the house, we don't know if it's going to be in his body, right? if it is, would you be shocked? >> i would be shocked. this is the first time in my career i have ever heard of diprivan being used in someone's home. >> larry: what do you make of it, robin? >> i think that that's very telling. i think this is a drug that c can't be confused with a recreational drug. this is a drug that can't be confused with having everyday practices or uses for people to use on their own. i think it's pretty damning. >> larry: ted, aren't there strong sleeping pills out there that people can get? >> one of the things with diprivan, it's not regulated. so prosecuting this would be, i think, difficult, because there's no need to regulate it, it's not supposed to be outside of the hospital. >> larry: it's just given in surgical matters by trained anesthesiologists, right?
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>> absolutely. >> larry: mark, wouldn't that case that if a doctor did do that, that's evidence of a crime? >> when you just heard your previous guest say that he's never heard of that in a home setting, and i've heard, i can't tell you how many doctors say the exact same thing, that's about as damning a testimony that you could ever want if you're a prosecutor trying to prosecute somebody, and the worst thing that's coming at you if you're defending a doctor in that situation. >> larry: if you take it a lot, would you even build an immunity to that, if you took diprivan regularly? >> diprivan is so powerful that you can sort of build a mild tolerance to the medication, meaning maybe an anesthesiologist has to administer a few more milligrams to put somebody to sleep, but it's impossible to actually build an immunity to the medication. >> larry: but if you did it yourself, you could die easily, because you don't have oxygen and a hospital scene around you? >> easily, easily. i use the medication in my
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practice about 10 to 15 times a day when i do procedures. and when i do it, there's an anesthesiologist with me that's administering the medication. and a lot of times, if you give a little bit too much of the medication, the patient stops breathing. >> larry: it's not a pain killer, right? >> no, only for anesthesia, only to induce sleep. >> larry: but if you were in pain, it would take your pain away, right, because you would be fast asleep? >> no. >> larry: it wouldn't? >> there's no pain properties of diprivan at all. >> larry: so if you were having a severe migraine and given dipriv diprivan, you would still feel the effects of the migraine? >> that's different. because there are studies that show it may help migraine headaches. but when we're talking about general pain, back pain, joint pain, neck pain, there's no pain properties to the medication. >> larry: robin, doesn't this whole pain thing boggle you. so many people in pain, emotionally and physically. >> it seems to be the convenient
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excuse. everybody has some kind of pain. at what point are we going to start managing our with our pai short of medication and drugs. >> larry: hold on. i was hearing two things at once. i'm sorry. ted, what do you make it as a member of society? >> one of the things that is interesting, people around him the nurse that came forward said he was having trouble sleeping and this was his thing. that is apparently why he was using it. as crazy as it sounds to anybody else, he was using it in the tour, he was getting up for this tour and he was getting decent rest. >> larry: mark, you defended him, you spent time with him, what indication will you see of michael and drug addiction? >> when i was representing him off and on for about 18 months i did not see any ed of disabling
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drug addiction or anything else. i saw somebody who was engaged in his defense and frightened to some degree about what was og on. i didn't see any evidence of what has become in a way a caricature of who he was. i render no opinion. i think a lot of it is speculation. i'm not so sure a lot of the people saying certain things are actually telling the truth as they know it. the only people i think would know are people in his inner circle within the last six months to a year. not a whole lot of them are talking. >> larry: isn't that one of the grave dangers of a story like this. >> absolutely. >> larry: on a 24 hour news cycle. rumors become fact. >> people like myself and mark, he is in a different position because he worked with him and
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knows him, we are speculating and i think it is clear at least from the toxicology or what we think the toxicology reports are going to say if someone is using that drug to sleep that is a problem. >> larry: we don't know it? >> people have been reporting daily, hourly about things we don't know about. >> larry: websites. >> a lot of it is false. he had a shot of demoral an hour before he died. >> obviously, there is a scandal dujour. some website posts it, according to this source, that source. before you know it, the thing is stated as fact. there is so much that has absolutely no basis in any fact and becomes so speculative.
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it does a disservice to the legitimate mainstream media. >> larry: let me get a break in. in connection with a remark made on wednesday's program, uri gella said he did not receive money in connection with the martin brashear interview with michael jackson. the doctor said he did. the dr. kline interview will be repeated tomorrow night. we'll be right back. hi, may i help you? yeah, i'm looking for car insurance that isn't going to break the bank. you're in the right place. only progressive gives you the option to name your price. here. a price gun? mm-hmm. so, i tell you what i want to pay. and we build a policy to fit your budget. that's cool. uh... [ gun beeps ] [ laughs ] i feel so empowered. power to the people!
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snoed ♪ we are the world we are the children ♪ ♪ there's a choice we're making ♪ >> larry: that is the memorial service in gary, indiana, the hometown of the jacksons. chicago, hello. >> caller: i was wondering about the interaction between the diprivan and the xanax? could that be the cause of the death. >> all of the medications combined have a synergistic effect, xanax can cause respiratory depression, add demerol and the diprivan, that is a lethal combination if not
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in a monitored setting. >> larry: it would be damaging to take diprivan with another drug. >> of course. >> larry: that is why if you are going into the hospital they want to know what drugs they have taken. you want to know on a patient you are operating on what is in his body? >> correct. >> larry: does it look like it is leading to charges, if it goes the way we are assume something. >> yeah. because of the infrastructure in place with the lapd and the ag and the dea working to collect evidence. they are looking at the doctors and prescriptions. if there is something in the blood and the coroner says this is homicide, you can bet there are going to be charges. whether if it will stick, who knows. >> larry: does it look that way, robin? >> just from -- >> larry: is that the road we are travel something. >> the road we are traveling is a road of investigation a
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thorough investigation. it appears if the evidence comes back where we can determine who the suspect was, what drug caused the death, yes, i would imagine there to be charges. >> mark, are you preparing to defend someone? >> i have been contacted. i don't know that i'm not conflicted in this situation. >> larry: doctors have contacted you -- you can tell me without telling the name. >> i have and i haven't decided whether i'm conflicted. i think i probably am. >> larry: because you represented jackson? >> right. ethically it is too thorny a situation for me to get into. >> larry: but is it a case if you were not involved with jackson one you would like to take? >> it is always -- any time you have a case where there are these kinds of issues, as a defense lawyer this is the kind of case you live on because you've got what i would consider to be an ambitious prosecution a situation where it is a novel
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theory to some degrees, it is kind of cutting edge in terms of using the criminal law in ways it is normally not used. if you enjoy the intellectual exercise of being a lawyer, that is intriguing. any defense lawyer is going to be intrigued by it. >> larry: dr. lala, without putting words in your mind, this boggles the mind to think of that drug in the home? >> definitely. >> larry: answesthesiologisanese it, not doctors? >> no. only used for anesthesia. >> larry: clear, only for surgery or hospital. could it be used in a plastic surgeon's office? >> yes. >> larry: thank you, panel. ted, stay on the job. tell rowlands is always


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